Benyi 0:00

All right, all right, all right. Welcome back to another episode of Stairway to Redemption. I know you guys miss us. It's been, uh, a long hiatus, like about 10 months. Um, well, I was busy with life, to say the least. Uh, nothing happened. It's just like, I, I guess one thing after another. I ran out of guest and, uh, I, uh, you know, post- postponed some episode and before I know it, time flew. But, uh, anyway, we're back here, uh, for a new episode. We have r- with our recurrent friend, Rich, who recently this week actually celebrated, or last week celebrated- Two week- Two weeks ago?

Rich 0:46

Two- July 25th.

Benyi 0:47

Yeah, July 25th. Celebrated four years, and as is per tradition in Stairway to Redemption, every, uh, anniversary, we do a check-in on our guests. And so today, uh, we do, um, recurring anniversary part four, Rich. Uh, the Electric Boogaloo part, you know, like w- w- what's, what's, what's going on, man? Like, you know. Uh, so yeah, welcome back, Rich. Hey. How you doing?

Rich 1:18

Good. Everything is good.

Benyi 1:20

Yeah.

Rich 1:21

You know, unlike in the past where it wasn't good. It was crazy and whatnot, but, but yeah, it's very good. Four years is something else and, um, I just sat back and, and just thinking about it and, and just amazed at, you know, where you go in four years. And it's one day at a time, which is great.

ad 1:46

Mm-hmm.

Rich 1:47

But, um, I mean, just, I, you know, it just flies by and I mean just It, you know, flies by, but you take one day at a time and it slows everything down because life can be crazy. And if you d- you know, I, I, I don't know. It just seems that by taking the slow, the pace of one day at a time, I don't know if it slows stuff down, to be totally honest with you, but it, but it, but it keeps things in check for me. And just one day, and it seems like th- then it's an eternity. I can't believe how long four years, you know, to go.

Benyi 2:23

Mm.

Rich 2:23

And, and seeing you at, at, at rehab.

Benyi 2:27

Yeah.

Rich 2:27

And you not knowing anything. No, I'm, I'm joking. But, but, you know, but it was like he couldn't even speak English. He was like speaking- Oh my God Senegalese. Oh,

Benyi 2:40

first of all, it's called

Rich 2:40

Wolof.

Benyi 2:40

Oh,

Rich 2:41

Wolof. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. I'm just busting his balls. No, they're

Benyi 2:43

gonna cancel you, man. But anyway, so I bet, uh, you kinda started already, but you know the tradition here at Stairway to Redemption, uh, first question is what your state of the mind, uh, or state of the mind address. So what's going on with you? What's new this, um, this year that was different from last year?

Rich 3:04

State of the mind. Hmm Well, you know, couple years ago, after my two-year anniversary, then I was going to church. I went to church, came out, and then I got hit in the back by a car, got into a major accident, and I was like, "Well, what is this? I just went to church." And I'm like, "What is it? What is..." You know. And then I was thinking about it now to, to, to, you know, 'cause I finally... I mean, my, my shoulder was ripped in three parts and, um, you know, uh... But then I did get a, a healing from mass from this guy, Alan Ames. He's from Australia. And, uh, he, um... 'Cause I don't know if I rem- uh, mentioned this in the last, uh, episode that we did. You might

Benyi 3:59

have. I'm not sure.

Rich 4:00

Yeah. But anyway, he was doing a healing mass at church. I didn't go. My sister went, had a picture of me on the phone, touched it, and, and he touched it, and then it was weird. One day I couldn't move my arm, the next day it was, like, fully functional, and it feels better. I always had shoulder problems, and it feels better. But I don't wanna, like, to, uh, you know, um, g- linger on with the shoulder. What I'm saying is that it was weird, and then now at four years, I'm thinking back that maybe that was a sign, because I'm always into signs. Maybe it was a sign from God to slow down.

Benyi 4:35

Mm-hmm.

Rich 4:35

And I was going too fast or to be, to have... I mean, I've always had gratitude. But I don't know what it was, but it, it just, it, it ma- it gave me a new perspective. Because at that point, everything was going well.

Benyi 4:49

Uh-huh.

Rich 4:50

And I was, like, 248 pounds and sexy, and, um, I'm kidding. But, but, you know, I was on my, on my go... And I was boxing with you. Mm-hmm. And I was doing all this stuff, and then it all stopped because of that accident, and I had to go to healing, to physical therapy. And then Through that, I couldn't really work out, so I gained weight. I went back and I went to 289. Now I'm down to 273. So now I'm in the right way because now physical therapy cleared me. So my mind, you know, and I was a little, you know, for a while there, I was, it was a little off because I was like, "What is going on? Why is this happening?" Mm-hmm. And, you know, because I was still sober and I was doing that, you know, I wasn't doing anything stupid.

ad 5:37

Mm-hmm.

Rich 5:37

And I was, you know, practicing the steps and, and, you know, as much as I could and, and, and going to speak at different places. But I really think it was a sign from God to slow down, and I did for... But I can't because I, I go a, a mile, you know, you know, I, I'm always going 10 miles a minute or, or more, or more and 100 mile, you know, I'm just- Uh-huh you know, take it to the next level always. But I did, you know, thinking about it back now, uh, at four years, I'm like, wow, that was like maybe something to just retrospect and, and, and, and take a look at things and, and, and smell the roses.

Benyi 6:22

Yeah. Um, I think I, I, I, I'm with there, I'm there with you because like, you know, that's something that's, something that's very difficult to see in early sobriety, especially one year or year one or year two, is that things not gonna, like the progression of life not, not gonna be linear like in the future, right? Right. Things gonna c- uh, s- you know, bad things still gonna happen, uh, or adversity is still gonna show up, you know, in different forms. Like it's not because we are not drinking that life's not gonna, you know, bad things not, you know, unpleasant things not gonna happen anymore. And in early sobriety, do we I think I'm gonna speak, we're so out of the woods that anything that happens for like that first year or two, two is so great that like, well, we, we can be under the impression that it's gonna be great forever until, well, you know, in your case- Yeah it isn't. It isn't. Something happens, you get hit by a car, like, you know, like you might lose your job, like a major event. Major events still happen.

ad 7:44

Yeah.

Benyi 7:44

And then you're like, "Oh, why? Like, what did I do to deserve this?" You know, things were being all right, I'm sober, and then boom, here is the, the great test. How do you react to that, right? And sadly, some people cannot, you know, react well. Like, you know, some people, I don't know, like I'm not judging them, but you know, depending on what that event is, especially with loss of other people, loss of a relationship, like they go back out.

Rich 8:17

Oh, yeah. And

Benyi 8:17

that's the big, that's a big test. That's where like, uh, to circle back to what you said, uh, about gratitude, I think gratitude is, is over- often overlooked. It's easy to-- We're so risk-averse, it's easy to remember what hurt us, like, you know, like- Yeah to, to, to be, um What do you call it? To, to remember the bad things, but not be grateful for the good things, right? Take a moment. Yeah. I,

Rich 8:47

I think you have to be gratitude. Gratitude, you have to give gratitude in both good and bad times.

Benyi 8:52

Yes.

Rich 8:52

Cause if you can j- uh, because anybody, anybody out there-

Benyi 8:56

Mm-hmm

Rich 8:57

in, in the world can be like, "All right, things are going great. I'm grateful for that." Yeah. All right? But when, you know, the proverbial what hits the what-

Benyi 9:06

Oh, we can swear. When the shit hits the fan hits the fan. There we go. For some explicit shit.

Rich 9:12

Yeah. When that happens- Yeah then, then, then, um, then, you know, are you still grateful?

Benyi 9:20

Yeah.

Rich 9:20

You know? And, and, and some people don't look at it like, oh wow, I have a house, I have a car, I have a job. This and that- Mm-hmm and whatever, and even though things are going bad and maybe I'm not making the type of money that I wanna make, or I'm not doing whatever I wanna do- Yeah at least be grateful for living, and that's the other thing. I'm living.

Benyi 9:41

No, that's, that's true. I agree.

Rich 9:43

You know, because it's like I, I, I wake up and I'm not pushing up daisies, so you know, I'm, I'm, I'm happy. Yeah.

Benyi 9:51

Like, uh, what you just said here about being grateful for both the great, the good and the bad reminded me of, um, the comedian Jimmy Carr. He said that, like, problems are a gift because we're designed to solve problems, to be grateful for them, and that boredom is, uh, unappreciated serenity because boredom never lasts. Like, we are not designed to be bored, right? Right. So when the calm is calm, appreciate it because you know it's not gonna last, and when the problem comes, be grateful because you know that you have something to solve, right? And I, when he said that, I was like- Yeah that's, that's, that's, that's a way to see things, right? Yeah. Well, no,

Rich 10:39

it is, and I really think, I mean- All the times you could go out and, and, and, you know, but what's that gonna do?

ad 10:47

Mm-hmm.

Rich 10:48

Going out and drinking because something bad happened, a girl broke your heart, guy broke your heart, if, you know, whoever broke your heart. Uh, or, or you lose a parent or, or you lose a relative, a s- brother, sister, whatever.

ad 11:02

Mm-hmm.

Rich 11:03

And, and, you know, but it's not gonna make things any better.

ad 11:06

Yeah.

Rich 11:06

It's, uh, it's, it's like, and I'm not trying to get into this whole thing, but it's like the death... You know, if someone gets killed and the death penalty, by murdering that person who took the life of someone else, and I'm not trying to get into that whole, because that's totally different than what we're talking about. Yeah. But it's like the same thing. Yeah, you're not gonna be able to bring that life back- The fact, yeah by killing someone else.

Benyi 11:29

Mm-hmm.

Rich 11:29

And, and, and, and it's the same thing with drinking and, and I'm not equating drinking with like, you know, being k- you know, but, but sometimes it is life and death. But I'm saying if, you know, y- uh, you can't, it's not gonna make things better, you know? Yeah. Doing anything crazy- Yeah is not gonna make things better. And what I'm saying about crazy is what we used to do or what I used to do in drinking and, and, and, and not just, "Oh, I'm gonna have two drinks."

Benyi 12:00

Yeah.

Rich 12:00

It would be 20 to 40, you know, whatever it was, and it was just crazy. And, and s- for now I have the tools, the toolbox from you know, inpatient, outpatient, AA, and I know what I, how to, how to do and who to reach out to- Yeah if something bad happens, like you or any one of the other people that I know, you know?

Benyi 12:24

No, it is definitely true that like, uh, trying to numb ourself when things go bad, uh, are not gonna... You know, I, I understand the parallel you're making between the death penalty, killing the person who, you know, who committed a crime or, like, doing something worse to make yourself feel better is not gonna fix thing. Because, you know, I think as a society, especially us, like, we, like yeah, as a society in general, we lost our ability to sit in a storm, you know? Like, when something doesn't go right, we want to feel good. Yeah. Like, yeah, we always want to feel good. And the problem with that, if you always want to feel good, you'll, you, you end up straight in rehab, you know? That's, that, that, that's, that's it. Yeah.

Rich 13:11

Always wanna feel good. And also, you know, w- the thing I was just hit me when we were talking about all this is the lack of forgiveness.

Benyi 13:19

Yeah.

Rich 13:19

And I believe, truly believe that y- if you don't have forgiveness, then it's going to hurt you because then you're gonna have resentment, and then you're gonna wanna drink or do something cr- uh, you know, crazed.

ad 13:34

Yeah.

Rich 13:35

Not crazed like go out and, you know, do, go on a rampage or do anything, but maybe a rampage of drinking.

ad 13:41

Yeah.

Rich 13:41

And maybe you're gonna lose yourself because, you know, um, what do they say? You know, um Lack of forgiveness or it, it, it's like drinking poison and hoping the other person is gonna die.

Benyi 13:57

Oh, yeah. Uh- Or, or- What that called? Revenge? Like something about like- The resentment so resentment is like, yeah.

Rich 14:03

And the same thing, it's like, you know, you, you just don't wanna do that. Right. Because, you know, 'cause everybody, like it seems like the society today, like you hit on, is they always wanna feel good and they wanna say, "All right, you did that, I'm gonna do this, and it's gonna make me feel better." But it really isn't.

Benyi 14:21

No, it's not. It's, it's, it's-

Rich 14:23

Maybe a, maybe a short term, you know, short term enjoyment, yes, it will in the short run. But long term, you're gonna then all of a sudden think back on it and be like, "Yeah, all right, I did that, but it's n- it didn't really improve the situation."

Benyi 14:38

Yeah. I remember, uh, year three last year on the podcast, uh, we talk about complacency, how you, like you avoided becoming complacent. I mean, we le- let's touch on it really quick. Uh, this year, what changed? Like what's, uh, you know, like what makes you not complacent again? Because, you know, like things you could get used to being sober and not stay spiritually fit, so.

Rich 15:06

What I started doing was, you know, more, um No, we're good Oh, okay I

Benyi 15:14

can clean that up

Rich 15:15

Oh, okay Yeah So you know what, what I go through every year is the steps, and I- it's kinda like an anniversary thing, and I go through them again, and I start reading again and, and, and practicing, you know, the principles and, uh, of AA and of being spiritually fit and, you know, just t- you know, taking it, uh, one day like the, like... I mean, I know it's a, it's a, it... We overuse word, but, you know, one day at a time is definitely something- Yeah ha- And, and complacent, I, I have to stay, uh, in the present because if I, like they say, if you're in the past or the future, that's not good. You wanna stay in the pre- because the past is what? Depression. And the future, you're, you're anxious, anxiety. So you wanna stay in the present, and that's keeps the complacency. And what I noticed was I started going to more meetings.

ad 16:15

Mm-hmm.

Rich 16:15

Not that I was gonna drink or anything, but I just was like, I, I don't know. It just happened naturally. It just happened organically-

ad 16:25

Yeah

Rich 16:25

where it was like, uh, and, and it wasn't forced, but I was like, "All right. Maybe I'm gonna go to that meeting now."

ad 16:32

Yeah.

Rich 16:32

And I just went, and it was close to home, so maybe that was it. It was easy. But, um, I went to a meeting that was, you know, I could walk to- if it, if it wasn't raining-

ad 16:42

Yeah

Rich 16:43

if I really needed to. But I, I, I just think I've always had it in the back of my mind, and I guess being in touch with a lot of different people and people that have gone out, our friend-

Benyi 16:55

Mm-hmm

Rich 16:55

and, um, you know, a, you know, we've had a couple of friends-

Benyi 16:59

We have

Rich 16:59

quite a lot you know, who we've gone out at, over little, over things, and they weren't spiritually fit. And- Yeah

Benyi 17:05

and,

Rich 17:05

you know, that kinda like slams it into your face, and it's like, "Wait a minute." You know, "That could be me." Yeah. "'Cause I could do the same thing if I don't watch myself." And I have to constantly, you know... And that's why it's like I do a lot, uh, you know, a lot of prayer is good-

ad 17:21

Yeah

Rich 17:21

because it gets you, uh, you know, a- and just, you know, a lot of y- uh, yeah, prayer for myself, but also meditation and reflection because it keeps you where you should be.

Benyi 17:35

No-

Rich 17:35

At least that's what I think

Benyi 17:37

no, that, yeah, like, uh, the meditation, the, the reflection, and going to meetings. Like, you know what we would like to touch on, on our friends who went out, like, you know, we had a solid crew when, uh, you know, we got out, and some of those friends, like, you know, they were able to put two years together. First year, I think like first year was easy for all of us. Like, we're like, we're fresh, we're motivated. And- And then, um

Rich 18:07

Not to cut you off- Yeah but they've always said, and I've heard from people in the program 30- Yeah 40 years, they're like, "First year's a gift."

Benyi 18:14

Yeah.

Rich 18:14

Second year is when you start doing the work."

Benyi 18:16

Yeah.

Rich 18:17

So, you know, but-

Benyi 18:18

And, and yeah, and then that, that shows after second year that like You know, unfortunately, like some of us, you know, apparently, I don't know, I don't want to say didn't do the work or... What I want to say is like, I realized personally that They always say it's in a room, like the alcohol and drugs are not the problem, they're the solution, right?

Rich 18:48

Yeah.

Benyi 18:49

I saw firsthand among our friends what their downfall was, and it was not drugs or alcohol. It wasn't. It wasn't. It was just their behavior. Like, you know, like other extracurricular stuff that like, you know, have nothing to do with drugs, but when they starting going back to those ways, the, it do- it was just a matter of time, like,

Rich 19:11

you

Benyi 19:11

know?

Rich 19:11

I think s- a lot of times that the problem is a mental defect.

Benyi 19:18

Mm-hmm.

Rich 19:19

And like they say, d- a defect of character, but like a mental, uh, issue and, and, and, and then there's also lack of spirituality and, and lack of... I don't know what, but it, it, it, it, it, then it goes to the drugs and the alcohol.

Benyi 19:35

Yeah.

Rich 19:36

But it's not like, "Oh, I can't stop drinking," da, da, da.

Benyi 19:39

No.

Rich 19:39

It's always something else- Always something else that's co- that's on your mind.

Benyi 19:43

Yeah.

Rich 19:44

You know, where you, you have to, you know, you're like, you know, you wh- where, where a woman or, or, or some situation- Yeah at home, your marriage, kids, whatever, and then that'll take you out to drinking.

Benyi 19:56

Exactly. Like, you cannot, I cannot conceive how y- a person who... I cannot conceive a per- sober person who is not a honest integrity. Like, for example, if you're a man, you cannot be sober long and cheat on your wife. That's not gonna hap- No because, like, eventually that's what's gonna lead you to, to drink. If you're a woman and you know, like, you know, you like codependent, let's say, and you bounce from relationship to relationship, you're not gonna stay sober long either. Like, you know? No. If you're another person, you s- you a bank robber or like you scam people, you're not gonna stay sober long. Like- You're not it's not, and it, those are nothing to do with the alcohol, but because of that way of life, that's not a virtuous way of life, you bound to, to go back. It leads. It leads you- It leads back, like

Rich 20:51

it leads you to the alcohol

Benyi 20:53

fall, like, and the drugs because there's a moment where willpower alone is not, is, is not gonna work.

Rich 20:59

Like- 'Cause I really believe, and, and it was like listening to people, and especially the other day, I went and I spoke at, at, uh, at one of the, the rehabs.

Benyi 21:08

Mm-hmm.

Rich 21:09

Um, and a- you know, one of the rehabs, and it, it was all new people and, and some were in there, you know, some were in there, but it, it was like, it wasn't like a long-term facility that, you know, you go and... Because sometimes they have the long-term, six months or more-

ad 21:27

Yeah

Rich 21:28

facility that you talk to. These were people that were fresh off the street. Uh-huh. Not off the street, but fresh to, to rehab, and they were brand new, and some of them were repeat offenders and this and that What I noticed was what every single woman, when they were talking, we-- they were talking about like not the alcohol and the drugs, but all the different situations that they were like in- Yeah with family or work or this or that. And, and you know, uh, you know, alcohol I guess, and drugs are a byproduct of what the real problem is.

Benyi 22:03

Is,

Rich 22:03

yeah. Because they've always said it to us at AA, and I didn't understand it the first year, where it was like, "I come for the drinking. I came for the drinking, I stay for the thinking."

ad 22:13

Mm-hmm.

Rich 22:13

And, and, and, and it makes sense now 'cause now, because once... Okay, yeah. And I'm not trying to lighten it up and say it's easy, but it's really not You follow these steps and, you know-

ad 22:25

Yeah

Rich 22:25

you, you stop drinking. And I'm not saying it's easy to stop because they're repeat- but I think that it's more inclined with your brain- Mm-hmm and what's going on than just the alcohol. 'Cause if it was just the alcohol, I think there'd be less alcoholics.

Benyi 22:42

Like, yeah, definitely. And, uh-

Rich 22:44

I think that a lot of alcoholics, it, it... And I would love, I don't know if they have or haven't-

Benyi 22:49

Mm-hmm

Rich 22:49

but done a research on how many of it is because of mental or other issues that are going on, and how much is it just purely, you know, "My, my family life is great, my job is great, everything else is great, but I just drink."

Benyi 23:04

I just drink, yeah. I,

Rich 23:05

I, I think it's something that, you know, really should be looked into.

Benyi 23:10

No, it is bec- um, when I spoke to your anniversary a couple weeks ago, I remember I mentioned that one of the reasons I was drinking and drugging was to fit in after I got my citizenship. All right. And my... So my problem was that I wanted to be cool and be, you know, liked by others.

ad 23:34

Yeah.

Benyi 23:35

And once I work on that and I f- really like, what do I even care, right? I did not feel the need to drink anymore. Right. Like, you know, I don't go out like I used to. Uh, when I go out, I enjoy the moment. Like, I go to games, I enjoy. I'm like, I don't... Like, the, just the fact that I do not want or need to please anyone or to, you know, seek external validation is just a weight off, you know. That, that was the problem to solve. That was not- Yeah like, stop drinking. That was- You know? And- Once I solved that problem-

Rich 24:13

And I c-

Benyi 24:13

the drinking went away,

Rich 24:15

you know? And, you know, I... And see, I think that the people that are the chronic relapsers, chronic, chronic this, and I'm not making fun of them at all. Yeah. I'm not saying I feel bad, but the reason that they do that or, or the reason that that happens, and, and I was wondering for myself too, I'm like... 'Cause, uh, you know, I saw an example of me relapsing and, and, and it wasn't alcohol. It was smoking.

ad 24:40

Mm-hmm.

Rich 24:40

I quit for 16 years, then I started helping this woman and, and, and, you know, it was early sobriety and this and that. Mm-hmm. And she happened to smoke. But, um- And, and, and like I ask for one cigarette, then I ask for another one. Then next thing you know, I'm buying a pack. And that's how it goes. And it's, and it kinda related to, to alcohol, you know, where this is how it happens. And I'm like, you know. So it kinda... I can understand how people relapse or how they, you know, because, you know, you put it down, you put it away, and I'm not comparing because it's a totally different addiction, but- Yeah I can see how, you know, you're just like, "Well, let me..." You know, 'cause it's al- because it's progressive. It's like slow, and then it's crazy. Yeah. And that's what happened with a couple of people were sharing at, at the, uh, at the se- you know, at the rehabilitation where I went, and they were saying how they had stopped for seven years, eight years, and then they were like, "Oh, I'll have a drink."

Benyi 25:46

No, yeah.

Rich 25:46

And, and the, the reason they had a drink was something bad was going on.

Benyi 25:49

Going on, yeah.

Rich 25:50

And then it was like, well, have two- Mm-hmm and three and four, and then it just progressively got worse.

Benyi 25:56

No, there are like, um, there are days where, like, I don't feel as spiritually fit as I think I should be. You know, I got a lot more into, uh, prayers. I went to a pilgrimage early- Oh, yeah this year with my mom. That was like, um, that was a great moment, man. I went to Medjugorje, a holy city in, uh, in Bosnia. I said it correctly this time. I couldn't pronounce that bo- that city for a hell of me, but I'm telling you, man, just like sitting there in the mountains, just chilling, no phone, just living the moment. And

Rich 26:36

being away from everybody.

Benyi 26:38

Being away from everybody, just, you know, praying. I mean, I, I pray. I didn't pray like crazy, but just sitting in the quiet calm, man, like And, and, and, and it was, it was, it was great. That's all I needed. I took pictures, but you know what was funny? When I came back home, my plan was, "Okay, I'm gonna take a few pictures, come back home, maybe post them on social media." But then I saw it, I was like, "Why do I even need to post it?" Like-

Rich 27:08

Yeah,

Benyi 27:09

yeah yeah, like, you know? Uh, so I just kept them in my phone. Sometimes I look at them, sometimes just, yeah.

Rich 27:15

You know, and, and, um, no, but that's the thing, 'cause I wanted something stronger. And so I st- started a couple of months ago to study to be a Third Order Franciscan.

Benyi 27:31

Mm-hmm.

Rich 27:31

Like St. Francis. And, um, you know, the, it's, it's a meeting. It's for laypeople, 'cause you have the, the, the Franciscan friars, then you have the Poor Clares, which are the female y- you know, religious, but this is like a lay, uh, version. It's non-religious. Although, you know, we do do all the reading, and it's not like- Yeah it's total cr- it's not like it's different. But, you know, it's the lay version where you can be married or whatnot, and, and you don't have to be, you know, take that deep of a, um, a vow of chastity and poverty and all of that. And I'm not saying that it's just all free fall- Mm-hmm free for all at, in the Third Order. But it's something that is really, you know, relates to me because it also kinda pulls in with AA, because there's a lot of service with the Franciscans. Like, we beg for food at the different stores. We have it a lot, like certain weekends. And it's funny, when we first heard it and they were like, "Oh, who wants to go beg for food?" And I was like, "What are we doing?" And then, and then it was like, "No, no, no, we, we, we a- we're begging." Mm-hmm. "But we're asking people to make a donation so we can fill up the food pantries on Long Island." Uh, and, and we did it at Rockville Centre, we did it in Long Beach at, at, at like the King Kullen, and then forget what the name of the, the... It was a different shopping cent- uh, different s- it was like Food Town or something down in, uh, Long Beach. And, uh, it was amazing how the people donated the food. We were just like, "Whatever you can spare." Yeah. We weren't asking for money. But that keys in to doing service like we do in AA. No, yeah. And, and, uh, you know, and so that, that's what drew me to that, and it's like increased my spirituality and my, um uh, y- my spiritual person. Uh, uh, you know, spiritual, not person, my spiritual, uh, perspective a lot more than what it has been in the past. Because if you... I think, I believe if you lack that component- Yeah uh, you're gonna, y- you're, you're gonna be putting yourself in harm's way.

Benyi 29:46

Yeah. We talk about gratitude and, uh, well now I think, uh, act of service is another definitely really key part besides gratitude to, to stay sober. Yeah, because like you said, if you somehow, I don't know, don't try to help either... It, it doesn't e- even have to be like, you know, any kind of volunteer work, but If you, if in a ki-- I, if there's no act of service where you, you cannot, like, give somebody a moment of joy or s- or, or peace It's hard to stay spiritually fit in that m- in, in that way because- A-

Rich 30:33

Yeah yeah, and, and the thing is, it's not like a bunch of... I, I, I met a couple of guys who are in the f- the Third Order, and they're in AA and this and that, and it, I mean, it's not like a, a, a prerequisite.

ad 30:46

Yeah.

Rich 30:47

But I see that a lot of people are drawn to it because it is service. Uh-huh. And if you don't do ser- y- y- if you don't do, like, volunteer work to, to whatever, you know, you should do service, or I had to do service, not I want to take it away from the you, 'cause I know-

Benyi 31:04

Yeah

Rich 31:04

people-

Benyi 31:05

I mean, it's like a g- general you. But- It's not like you, you.

Rich 31:08

Yeah, I know. Yeah. But the way- Okay, yeah everybody at AA tends to think- I'm all upset, like you're-

Benyi 31:13

Keep it in the eye, they

Rich 31:14

say. Yeah like, like you're picking on them, and it's like, no, it's a, you know, a third person. Yeah. You know. But anyhow, with the, you know, like, the, the, the service component, it's like, 'cause if you are bringing coffee, if I'm bringing coffee and I'm the coffee man and I don't show up because I'm doing something or that I shouldn't be doing, I'm letting down the whole group. Yeah. And so it kinda keeps you, you know, grounded and it's like, "All right, I gotta do this- Mm-hmm because everybody's relying on me."

Benyi 31:46

Yeah.

Rich 31:47

People are gonna get pissed if they don't have their coffee. Yeah. Except on the beach, because we don't have to, you know, we bring our own. Yeah. But when you're inside, you know, and doing stuff like that, but I really think that service is something that took over for me this year.

Benyi 32:03

No, and also another component of the act of service too, act of service you can find your purpose.

Rich 32:09

Yeah.

Benyi 32:09

And like, a, um- A man without purpose is a dangerous man, you know, because- Yeah like, he- they're just wandering the world not knowing what the hell they're supposed to do, and that's what makes them d- dangerous. Like, if you, you're wandering the world not knowing what you're supposed to do or d- that don't even have a clue or how to find out what you're supposed to do, like, you can easily go back to numbing yourself, you know?

Rich 32:41

Yeah, and that's the thing that's really scary. Mm-hmm. 'Cause, I mean, we, you know, and like we're going back to the whole thing. You know, we had people that were, you know, the first year and going, circling back to that, and, and they were great and every... And, and it wasn't even that they were on the pink cloud and then they came off. I, I just think they forgot to do what we do.

Benyi 33:04

Uh-huh.

Rich 33:05

Practice your 12-step things. You and, and I'm not saying you and I are the best in the world.

Benyi 33:08

Hell no.

Rich 33:09

That's, because- because, because, because the two of us do our own thing. We, we have a, a different program. It's not, I, I know it's not the cl- I know my program isn't the cleanest one, but it, it works. And w- you know, I know that if you and I, if I don't see you or we don't go to a meeting, I'm like, "Ah, something's up."

ad 33:28

Yeah.

Rich 33:30

And then when you're like, "No, I'm tired," I'm like, "All right, then, then we can skip the meeting 'cause I'm tired too." But- Yeah. No, I go to- But, but, you know, like, the thing is, I think that when people, and I'm not trying to generalize this, but I've noticed that, you know, our friends-

ad 33:48

Uh-huh

Rich 33:48

who have fallen away, and we went to rehab with them, and we were in outpatient with them And we were, yeah, we were rehab and outpatient, and we were even in AA groups with them. The reason they fell out is they didn't practice.

ad 34:07

Yeah.

Rich 34:08

And it's not like practice like you're practicing basketball shots. No.

ad 34:11

Yeah, no. It's not like that.

Rich 34:13

It, it, it's, it's practicing, you know, the different... Uh, and I guess you could relate it to pra- uh, pr- uh, practicing a basketball shot. Uh-huh. 'Cause it's like you wanna do the steps, and you gotta do them. And, and, and even... A- and it's not like where you have to get crazy and do the steps. Uh, you know, "Oh, I'm on step one," blah, blah. If you just are nice to people, good to people, you don't hurt someone, you don't hurt yourself, you're gonna do the steps.

Benyi 34:41

Yeah. Like, uh, the way I... If I were to make an, uh, analogy to it, I see it like as, you know, having a tank, a full tank of sp- uh, uh, spiritual, uh, or spirituality or being spiritually fit, right? You can go around with half a tank, you know. You know, the tank doesn't have to be full- Yeah right? But when you run on empty, you better check that light and go back. So, like, there are times where I will not go to meetings for, like, a few weeks, you know, like maybe two at the most, and then, like, something is off, you know? Like- Yeah I feel like I'm off, that I need to get back on the horse. Like the same thing with the gym. Like I don't go to a gym- Oh, yeah for, like, I feel like I'm off. I need to go. Like it... And I'm grateful for that feeling that I feel like I'm off- Yeah that I need to go back to, to what I'm doing. Like I'm not, you know, I'm not, I'm not there.

Rich 35:38

And it keeps you present.

Benyi 35:39

It

Rich 35:40

keeps, yeah. Because, you know, now I'm like back. Because I was doing the physical therapy for my arm, my shoulder, and that worked, and then they released, didn't release me. I, I guess they cleared me and said- release is like, oh, I got out of prison.

ad 35:55

Yeah.

Rich 35:56

No, they cleared me, and they said, "You can go back to the gym." They did this a lot, you know? And then I, I went back to the gym and then I hurt myself because I was being like... I, I thought I was 25 years old again- Yeah and lifting stupid weights. So then I had to go back and get more physical. But this time around I'm doing it the right way and taking my time, and my brother-in-law is helping me. He's guiding me through it. So he's like... He, he's a physical therapist, but he's like guiding me and we're doing like 45 minutes in the morning.

ad 36:29

Uh-huh.

Rich 36:30

And we're starting out with the treadmill and then we're gonna work our way, uh, uh, up to, you know, what we wanna, what I wanna do. But, um... And, and, and, and that is almost like syno- It's like similar to like when you're trying to stay sober and you're trying to, you know, just j- you know, y- one little step at a time. You don't have to do all 12 steps on one day, you know? And, and, and if you learn that I think things could be good.

Benyi 37:01

No- You know? Yeah, definitely.

Rich 37:02

You don't have to do everything at once. I mean, eventually I'm gonna get back to boxing and stuff- Yeah 'cause I, I'm, I'm itching to do that.

Benyi 37:09

Yeah.

Rich 37:10

And, and really I, I, I s- see the bags at the gym and I'm like, "Ah." Take it- Take,

Benyi 37:16

take, take your time, man take my time. You don't, you don't need to lose, to lose your shoulder again.

Rich 37:20

Yeah. But, but, you know, and then it's like very small steps and then you build them up all together. And that's the one thing that I've learned in the fourth year is that- You know, progress, not perfection. Yeah. Some of these things that they say, you think, "What the are they talking about?"

ad 37:40

Yeah.

Rich 37:40

Come on, don't, don't drink and go to meetings. Duh. Yeah. You know? But, but like now some of them are really coming true and it's like-

ad 37:50

Uh-huh

Rich 37:50

you know, progress. You just wanna, you know, like Kobe Bryant, he wasn't an alcoholic or drug addict, but I loved his book, "Black Mamba," and it was like if he could just be better every single day-

ad 38:02

Yeah

Rich 38:03

he said he'd be the best NBA player, and I believe he was- He did before he died. But, but you know, I mean, but that's, um, neither here nor there. You know, if, you know, but when, you know, but like he said that in, in that book, and I took it to the alcoholic-

ad 38:19

Mm-hmm

Rich 38:20

drug addict or whatever, and if you could just improve, and I'm better today than I was yesterday.

ad 38:26

Yeah.

Rich 38:26

Game over. Not game over, but game is improving. And, and just another, you know, and then I've, I've conquered it, you know, where I'm better today than yesterday, and then tomorrow hopefully I'm better than I was today.

Benyi 38:38

No, you, you, you, you hit it right on, uh, the nail right on the head right there because I noticed that recently we've been bom- uh, bombarded with, especially through social media, through, uh, optimization through everything. Like, you know, drink this powder, like, you know, creating this optimized, uh, uh, supplement, optimize this. Oh, no, at the gym you need to do all this to optimize your gain. Like optimization is everywhere. Optimize your sleep, optimize your revenue, optimize your return, or like optimize looks maxing is optimizing how you look. Like- Oh we're so obsessed now right now with optimizing sh- stuff that like People forget about progress and not perfection, which is the reason why you see things like people, uh, giving up on the gym after, like, a month because they, they went all in all at once. Like, you know, like- Yeah I'm gonna go five days a week, but I never went a w- a day a week.

Rich 39:44

Like- They think, you know, they think they're gonna be, like, perfect tomorrow. No. You just progress, not perfection. Yeah. You have to just a little bit each day. And also, social media is as good as it can be, it's terrible. Yeah. Because, I mean, I, I'm not on it anymore. I used to be, but I'm trying to be detached. That's another thing I noticed in my four years.

Benyi 40:09

Mm-hmm.

Rich 40:10

And, and it wasn't like I was the social media king or anything like that, but just I, I was wasting time and, and, and scrolling and doing whatever. And then things would get me pissed off. Yeah. Whatever it was, like, it- whatever it was that they were showing- and I would just get upset. There would be a thing about the Yankees sucking and this and that.

ad 40:35

Yeah.

Rich 40:35

And I'd be like, "Ah, I'm gonna go kill that person." Not k- literally do it, but I would just get upset with, with- Mm-hmm you know, or they would say something else that was stupid about-- They would, uh, you know, uh, make fun of New York State or this or that or whatever, or make fun of the religion, and then I just was like, "I gotta get off of it because I don't need it." And, and, you know, I, I, I can... I tw- you know. But sometimes it was bad because then, like, I wasn't on social media forever, and this is going back a couple of months, and I didn't know that we were, like, in a war with Iran. To be totally honest with you, I did not know that. I like- Yeah. And, and it's amazing because... And, and the point I'm trying to make is that, you know, like social media will be like, "Oh, this is the worst," da-da-da, this and that. Uh, we're still living, man.

Benyi 41:26

Yeah, we're still living. The Earth

Rich 41:28

is still spinning. We're still-- The st- it's still here. Yeah. And, and, you know, like they would say, "Oh, so and so is gonna destroy the world a- as, as the president or, or, or this senator or this," you know, whatever. And it's like, "Hey, we're still living, baby."

Benyi 41:42

Yeah.

Rich 41:42

And, and, and the thing is, by getting away from social media, I'm not... I'm saying for me it worked. Maybe someone else it will. Yeah. Or at least deactivate it, take off a little bit of time-

ad 41:54

Uh-huh

Rich 41:54

for, for just take a break.

ad 41:56

Yeah.

Rich 41:57

And, and, you know, 'cause that- that's the whole, the culture of, you know, just checking my phone and seeing what's more important. Yeah. Like they did a thing, they did a research thing that like People in a certain age group, the first thing they do when they first wake up is to check their Facebook

Benyi 42:14

No

Rich 42:14

And I'm like, "Come on."

Benyi 42:16

Come on, no.

Rich 42:16

Come on, you c- y- you know, uh, uh, I-- or they check something and I'm like, "Come on. You have a lot, you know, come on, people, you can be a lot better than that."

Benyi 42:25

I, I don't, I don't check the, my phone in at least the first 30 minutes when I wake up, because I wake up, you know, I of- obviously brush my teeth, wash my face. I pray. I meditate. I chill. So like it's not even it... 45 minutes to an hour until I, I, I, I check the phone,

ad 42:53

you know? Oh, yeah. I mean, it's

Benyi 42:54

like- Like it's crazy. Checking the phone in the fir- first five minutes is, unless like I'm expecting something or like, I don't know. It's, it's not- Okay it's not, it's not, it's, it's crazy. But like-

Rich 43:07

It's one thing you could check, uh, you know, whatever, but not social media stuff and it's like, you know, it's like, because then you're, uh, uh, but you're right. You gotta pray. You gotta do. Mm-hmm. You gotta wake up. I wanna have a cup of coffee. I wanna be peaceful. I don't wanna be-

Benyi 43:22

Yeah

Rich 43:23

cause if you're waking up and you're checking shit out while, you know, when you're first waking up, that's probably gonna destr- that's gonna wreck your day if there's some bad news there. Arms across.

Benyi 43:35

No, I took, uh, social media off my phone for a while. I only had it on a old phone that never leaves home because, I mean, there's no service on it. I just, it just uses Wi-Fi. So when I go home, that's when I can check it, and then I reinstalled back on my regular phone, but I turn off the notification and I barely notice it. Like I barely even check it, you know? Like I'm, I cannot be on it for more than half an hour. Like my usage must be like an hour a day top, like because it, it gets to me really quick that like, you know, the algorithm figured out, the social media algorithm figured out that like anger is what keeps the engagement the most, and that coupled with the fact that the news media also figured out that anger is what keeps us the most engaged. Like that's crazy because as to go back to people who are in recovery E If you, if a person in recovery stayed that connected to the rest of the world, and the rest of the world is hell-bent on, and there are institutions in the rest, in the, in the world that are hell-bent in making you angry, then those tools are... You are using those tool, you are prone to, to, to go back and to rel- to rel- relapse

Rich 45:09

If there was a ne- news channel and it was like, "You know what? Uh, everything's beautiful today. You know? There's no fighting."

Benyi 45:19

Is it the good news channel?

Rich 45:20

Yeah, the good news channel. There's no fighting, there's nothing. Oh. And we love each other and, you know, everybody is just at peace. They would-- That news channel would never, would last maybe a day, but they gotta scare the hell out of you.

Benyi 45:35

No, they have

Rich 45:36

to. "Oh, if you eat this. Oh, now this is recall." I'm seeing more things recalled than ever.

Benyi 45:41

Yeah.

Rich 45:41

And I know it's like probably there's a lot more research and it's more available, but, um, I was thinking back to tw- you know, before, uh, uh, you know, uh, uh, and just going to the flip phone.

Benyi 45:56

Yeah.

Rich 45:57

Where you can answer the phone and you can text people, but that's it. Yeah. You can't do anything else.

Benyi 46:01

And, uh, play Snake on it. That's it.

Rich 46:03

I, yeah.

Benyi 46:04

Yeah. And,

Rich 46:05

and I think everybody would be better. I don't know. Who, uh, you know, maybe they should do an experiment of that and see if, if we just flip back to just the normal phone. No, I remember- But I don't think anybody would ta- do that. I don't know, maybe.

Benyi 46:22

No, I remember vividly that the best sleep I ever had was in rehab. Like, when they took my phone away. Oh, yeah. And like there was very little you had. Like, all you do was, you know, work on yourself, like with the counselor. Yeah. The groups, uh, the groups meeting, talk about, you know, what plagues you, eat, watch a movie at night, and go to bed. Yeah. And I was like, "Yeah."

Rich 46:50

And you make a phone call, and that's why- Oh,

Benyi 46:52

phone call days. Yeah,

Rich 46:54

I remember those that phone, you, you have the phone and the quarters.

Benyi 46:57

Yeah.

Rich 46:57

Because of course they don't have payphones anymore today.

Benyi 47:00

Yeah. Yeah.

Rich 47:01

I, I don't think we have any, but in, in hospitals and, you know, they have it at rehab facilities. Yeah.

Benyi 47:08

Oh, yeah, re- it wa- it was what? A dollar to make a

Rich 47:11

c- Yeah

Benyi 47:11

$1.50 to make

Rich 47:12

a call. Well, what it was. Yeah. But, but, but, you know, it, it, it was good, and that was great because you could work on yourself. And then All of a sudden you get out and that's where you gotta wa- I, I had to watch it. Uh-huh. Because it was like, you know, that was great. I worked on myself for 30 days. Now let's try to keep, put that up.

Benyi 47:33

Keep that up. Yeah. All right, so we talk about gratitude, one, being one piece that maintain your sobriety. The other was definitely act of service. Then we talk about like, you know, social media and staying away of like what, you know, what is designed to scare you or to, uh, piss you off or basically ba- bring those bad emotions that, you know, there's nothing you can do about basically. And,

Rich 48:00

and then we also talked about lack of forgiveness and resentment.

Benyi 48:05

Oh, yeah. Let's go back to that. So how, how you deal with lack of forgiveness and resent because we barely touched that. Like, you know, me personally, I'm a-- I can be a... I ruminate a lot. I can be a pretty resentful person. Like, you know, I play like scenarios in my head where like, "Ah, I should not have... I should have said this. Now that person gonna think that I'm a punk. I should probably beat them up."

Rich 48:32

You know what I did? You know what I did a couple of weeks ago? Yeah. And, and it was like crazy.

ad 48:37

Mm-hmm.

Rich 48:38

So I went to church And then I went to my car, and I'm at my car, and this guy pulls up behind me and he's like, "Can you move up two feet?" And I'm like, "No." 'Cause I was upset, and I had just got out of church, but I was still- Yeah I, I, I forget what it was, but I was upset. Oh, you know what it was? There was something the matter with the car or whatever, and I was just... And, and then I was on the phone. I had to call someone, and I was upset and, and so then I took a, you know... So I pulled off-

ad 49:12

Uh-huh

Rich 49:12

eventually. And then I'm driving up the one, the road, uh, one of the streets, and I'm like, "I gotta go back and find him and apologize." So I go back and I find the guy. Literally f- I, I was so happy I found him and I said, "I gotta apologize. I was being a dick." And, and, and he looked at me and he's like, "Are you a friend of Bill's?" 'Cause he was going into a meeting. No

ad 49:35

way.

Rich 49:35

There was a meeting at the church that day- Yeah, yeah at 10 o'clock. Uh-huh. I had just gotten out of the 9 o'clock Mass. And he was-- And, and then I didn't go, but then following... Because they have meetings there Tuesday and Thursday. So then the next week or so I went and I saw him there. But it was funny because he was like... 'Cause he said to me, he goes, "Nobody would ever come back and

ad 49:58

s-

Rich 49:58

and apologize-" And then that's what you did, yeah or like that." And he's like, "I..." He goes, "You know," he goes, "I'm pro..." He-- And he was like, "Yeah, I understand it." Yeah. He's like... I said, "I was shocked you didn't, like, start screaming back at me when I said no." 'Cause like he just said, "Oh, okay."

ad 50:13

Yeah.

Rich 50:13

And, and got back in his car. But you know, that's the whole thing that, you know, with the lack of forgiveness, resentment. Uh-huh. And I think we get to learn... I st- I, I, I don't know. I think I'm learning to be better about that, where I used to be like

Benyi 50:32

Yeah.

Rich 50:33

It still, I still have my moments where my anger, I'm an angry man.

Benyi 50:38

I was, uh-

Rich 50:38

But-

Benyi 50:39

Yeah

Rich 50:39

I prayed, and I still do, for these women that pissed me off, broke up with me, or I broke up with them, and then it was just a bad thing. And yeah, some broke up with me, I broke up with some, and then it was like, oh, they did this and they did that. And, and instead of being resentful towards them, I would pray for them- Mm-hmm and hope that they're doing well. And peop- people in the meetings are like, "You're crazy." You know, I'm like, "No, I'm not." Yeah. Because then, because then it's lack of forgiveness. Like that. And I let that go. And I don't call them up and say, "Oh, by the way, you know, you broke up with me five years ago, and I'm pissed off." I'm not pissed off. I'm praying for you, and hopefully you're doing well.

ad 51:23

No, that, that don't work like that.

Rich 51:25

I, I'm not doing that. Yeah. And it only works for you-

Benyi 51:27

You

Rich 51:28

cause it makes me feel good, you know? And then- Because even if I called them and said, "Oh, by the way, I'm praying for you."

Benyi 51:38

No, that's, that

Rich 51:38

is... Yeah. They, they wouldn't care. Yeah. They really wouldn't care because... And some people who piss you-- men or women or whatever, and it doesn't have to be just a relationship, it could just be a business deal or whatever, they don't know that they piss you off.

Benyi 51:53

Mm-hmm.

Rich 51:53

They don't know that they did something to you. But by praying and having that, that forgiveness and then the resentment goes, it's been another world. But I still get pissed off when people driving-

Benyi 52:07

Oh, yeah

Rich 52:07

people honk, you know? And-

Benyi 52:09

When you j- Long Island is-- New York in general, but especially Long Island, like the driving scene here is like, it's, it's like no other. Like you go in PA, people are respectful. I don't know about down South.

Rich 52:20

And, and, uh, people have been-

Benyi 52:21

Uh

Rich 52:22

I've been down South

Benyi 52:23

and- Yeah

Rich 52:24

but, like-

Benyi 52:24

But Long Island is like dog

Rich 52:27

eat dog But I just have to, I just have to just swallow and, and just look and just let everybody go ahead and do whatever to try-- because otherwise I'm gonna be driving like-

Benyi 52:38

Crazy

Rich 52:39

like a crazed man.

Benyi 52:41

Yeah.

Rich 52:41

And, and, you know, this all goes to forgiveness, resentment, and I, I don't know, I try to be a calmer individual 'cause I see it sometimes and I eat more. Not eat more because I'm trying to lose weight, but like I notice that when I don't have food in my system- Mm-hmm then I

ad 53:02

get

Benyi 53:02

angry. Yeah. That like, uh, me, it's like when I don't have enough sleep, I need to be really mindful of that. Yeah.

Rich 53:07

Well, that too. That too. Oh, no. So it's like sleep and food. Yeah, yeah. Gotta watch it because if I don't have the right combination, then, then, then you don't wanna come-

Benyi 53:15

Yeah

Rich 53:16

two inches close to me.

Benyi 53:18

No, you, you sh- uh, again, you, you, you hit the, the nail on the head here. And, uh, yeah, forgiveness and, uh, avoiding resentment is definitely something I need to work more on. Like, you know, when I pray, I always pray for the courage to, to for, you know, God to grant me the courage to forgive those who offended me because it doesn't flow easily on me. Because like, you know, there's a, there's a part of me that like, what I stru- struggle with is that I could-- I was given a gift to be physically stronger than most of my peers and Sometime, like I, I, I, I'm not getting a kick off like, you know, intimidation or anything like that. Yeah. What I'm getting a kick out of is like, I could just knock the person who offended me and it w- there will be peace and everything will be quiet. And it's that peace and quiet that nothing will... I won't lo- I will no longer be bothered. So I don't care how they feel or like, you know, like, you know, just fear will bring me peace, right? Yeah, yeah. Like, if I scare everybody, nobody will fuck around with me, and I will have peace. But it's not a virtuous way to do things.

Rich 54:54

No.

Benyi 54:54

That's not the right way. And like somebody said, um, I heard it somewhere, the Right thing to do is often the hard thing to do, right? Mm-hmm. Like, I cannot go around because, like, you know, somebody pissed me off, punch them, knock them out, and be like, "Okay, now the, everything is quiet." You know? Like, things gonna happen. Some type of adversity gonna always come, but, like, I cannot, like, just choose violence and, and that's what, to link it back to resentment, sometime I'm like, "I let that go. I should have chosen violence." Yeah. Like, because violence would have solved that problem right away. Like, you scare them, they're never talking to you again, and then, yeah, like, you know, the peace is there, and it's peaceful. But then I... And it's crazy because sometime I know that I kinda made the right decision, but with my temper, it doesn't feel like it, you know? And, and sometimes- It doesn't feel like it and,

Rich 55:53

and now we don't know- Yeah who's gonna pull a gun. Yeah. Or who's gonna do something. Oh, yeah. You don't know. You might knock someone out, maybe here in the park, and then they're gonna run to their car and pull out a shotgun. Get a

Benyi 56:09

shotgun and shoot you. Like- Yeah men have no honor these days, man.

Rich 56:12

I, I mean, there was no... You know, it used to be.

Benyi 56:15

Yeah.

Rich 56:15

Like when I, you know, 20, 30 years ago, when I was younger, it was like I am upset with you. You're upset with me. All right. Let's fight. We'd fight. Someone knocks some- one out or the other out, and then we get up and shake hands.

Benyi 56:27

Yeah. I, I grew up like that, too.

Rich 56:30

Like, you know? And, and it, and it was like, you know, and it was over.

Benyi 56:33

Mm-hmm.

Rich 56:33

And it was over. There was no lingering-

Benyi 56:35

No, there was no lingering of whatever

Rich 56:36

Yeah. But now it's like... You know, so I just... And I'm still, it's a work in progress. Progress, not perfection, bro. Yeah. You know, and, and, and, and it's like, you know, just trying with that anger.

Benyi 56:51

Mm-hmm.

Rich 56:52

Because e- and then now I'm like, one thing I'm learning is that I'm thinking four steps ahead of people.

Benyi 56:57

Yeah.

Rich 56:58

I'm like, "If I smack him, knock him out"-

Benyi 57:02

What's gonna happen?

Rich 57:03

what's gonna happen three, four step... You know?

ad 57:05

Yeah.

Rich 57:05

A- and, and, you know, or not even, like, a fight, but i- i- if, if, if I do that, then I cut them o- you know, and I'm like, "You know what? The guy behind me is up on my ass." Yeah. And, and I'm like If I slam on the brakes, it's his fault, but then it's gonna waste time because then I have to file a claim and everything. And, and so I'm like, "You know what? Let me just let..." I pulled over now. Now I pull... If, if, unless it's on the southern state, but now I pull over. If someone's, like, right up on me- Yeah I'm like, "All right, you're in a rush. Go past me." The other day a guy did that, and he was like, sped away real fast, and then he got pulled over.

Benyi 57:44

Oh, yeah.

Rich 57:46

So, like, there is justice in the world. There's

Benyi 57:48

that justice somewhere, man. Oh, man, I've seen that happening too. Uh, it's funny. All right. All right. We're hitting, um, the hour mark here.

Rich 57:58

Okay.

Benyi 57:59

Uh, so yeah. What, um... So to resume, what kept you, you know, to maintain your sobriety and not fall in complacency, we say, one, gratitude, two, act of service, uh, three, staying away of things that are designed to make you, uh, to form basically your anger and your bad emotions, like social media- Oh, yeah the news and that kind of stuff, those toxic people, whatever. And lastly, we talk about forgiveness, um- Lack of it, I think, lets- Like, yeah

Rich 58:33

allows the devil in.

Benyi 58:34

Mm-hmm.

Rich 58:35

You know, like, you know, um, the biggest trick that the dev- And not to get all deep, but, like, biggest trick the devil pulled was that he doesn't exist.

Benyi 58:45

Yeah. Yeah.

Rich 58:47

And then you see it, you pull it out, you know, and it's like I can be devilish sometimes, and it's like I gotta watch myself. Mm-hmm. You know, stay away from that, and stay away from those things. Yeah. And, um, and pray.

Benyi 59:02

All right. So that was Rich, year four, wiser than ever.

Rich 59:08

Oh. Let's see.

Benyi 59:09

All right.

Rich 59:10

One more.

Benyi 59:11

Thanks, guys, for- Thank you listening to us. And, uh, I, I hope to see you back sooner than, than a, a year from now, so. Yes,

Rich 59:19

definitely. We have to

Benyi 59:20

do

Rich 59:20

this a little bit

Benyi 59:21

more. More often. All right, guys. Bye.

Rich 59:24

Bye.